Wow that's a new one. How many miles on it and did it sit for a long time?

I can't figure how it would rust unless there was water in there somehow. Condensation?

 

It's got 54K on it. I can't speak to whether it sat a long time or not. My guess would also be condensation.

It also looks like the 'add to cart' at Partzilla didn't add the right number of metal plates so the stock clutch is closer to $250. Which is about the same price as the Barnett clutch kit.

Anyone have any thoughts about the Barnett clutch? (I'm off to use the search now.)

 

Are you totally sure it was rust? That pattern makes me think of when someone keeps the brake pressure on a hot set of brakes and it deposits material. Maybe the PO cooked the discs and let it sit, depositing material on the steel plates. How did the material on the clutch plates look or feel?

 

Pretty sure it was rust. It was pitted underneath when I sanded it off. I didn't actually inspect the friction plates, just dumped them in some oil to soak them. That was probably a mistake on my part.

In any case I think the clutch is cooked.

 

Are you 100% sure the clutch is fully bled and preferably reverse bled? I have done a LOT of hydraulic bleeding over the years and the FJR clutch is one of the fussier ones I have delt with.

 

I have bled the clutch several times, and even rebuilt the master cylinder.

I have bled it both by hand (squeeze the lever, etc) and using my Mity Vac.

BTW, did you know the service manual says you should replace the rubber cups in the master cylinder every two years? Who does that?

Tell me about "reverse bleeding".

 

Just bleeding from the endpoint back to the master cylinder. I have a couple huge clear syringes for it, one for pushing the new fluid in at the clutch slave cylinder, one for draining out of the master cylinder.

They are nice because I can see the tiny bubbles in the fluid and tap the syringe until they all leave.

That reminded me I had broke the system open the other day and thought the rag trick might work to get the air out, but no such luck. I just bled it, took maybe 10 minutes and it feels great again now.

 

Got it, I watched a yootoob video after asking the question. You just push the fluid back into the master cylinder? The video suggested cracking the banjo bolt at the master cylinder, but that feels like a good way to make a big mess.

I'll get some syringes and give it a shot.

 

The video suggested cracking the banjo bolt at the master cylinder, but that feels like a good way to make a big mess.

twforeman,

FWIW, you can get banjo bleeder bolts now, good for bleeding brake lines at the handlebar master cylinders. ~US$ 24 each at the right shops, or US$ 40+ at the wrong shops. You can put a rubber hose on the bleeder itself then wrap with a shop rag, to keep the mess in check. I'd recommend using new hydraulic washers when changing banjo bolts, anytime. HTH.

 

With most of the ones I have done you can just push the fluid back into the master, sometimes a little pressure via a rag tied around the grip and lever help if there seems to be unusually stiff resistance.

 

I doubt this is a bleeding issue. And what did the other clutch plates look like? Especially the few unique one's that have more material on them?

 

Some were much worse than the photo, some looked fine.

I'm going to try a reverse bleed tomorrow, but doubt it will change anything. If it's the same afterwards I'm just going to get new plates.

 

There may be something else going on, but any motorcycle clutch issues for me are always: Adjust lever all the way out for maximum stroke, oil change, bleed, then do a couple fairly high slip starts or friction zone parking lot maneuvers. If those don't clean it up and get it working correctly, time to start disassembling.

 

If the hydraulic system was dry as if starting from new, just fill the reservoir, open the bleeder and wait a few minutes.... gravity will fill the line in this case since it's all downhill. Then do a regular bleed to finish it off......

As for you clutch plates being rusty, clearly an issue of no oil getting to them, and very likely sat for a long time....... oil does not flow to all the clutch plates, mostly the two inner ones and maybe a couple others get oil and the rest if you are lucky. That's why we do a clutch soak...... oil flow diagram in yellow.... we wish we had more (the red).

As for replacement clutch, I'm not a Barnett fan, I'd go all OEM.

 

The newer FJRs have a slipper clutch, which you can install as a mod on older FJRs. The clutch core has more oil holes than the older style part. Alternately, you could simply drill the "extra" oil holes in your existing cutch core to match the newer part. That mod will increase the oil flow to the clutch.

I believe that fast shifting, clutchless shifting, and sitting at traffic lights or stop signs in Neutral will all deprive your clutch plates of the oil they should get normally. If you are in gear when stopped, the clutch plates are getting oil, fine, and if you need to evade some fool, you won't need to waste time looking for a gear; you can just take off.
My US$ .02 worth . . .

 

Another perspective, about 2-3 years ago, I took my friend's '16 apart for a clutch clean and soak, and while it had the extra holes/slipper, outer plates still rather dry. The holes help, but I think not a whole lot. Oil just doesn't seem to get out that far..... he had an issue last year that caused us to go in there again, removed clutch and hmmmm, very little oil on those outer plates again..... I'd say, just do a clutch soak if you're having issues with clutch not disengaging at idle or that initial shift into first clunks too much.....
In the OP's case, well, no question a new clutch pack is warranted. I still can't believe it got rusty..... now, one COULD take each metal and friction plate and rub on say 600 grit wet/dry sandpaper (on a flat surface such as a sheet of glass), and polish off the surface rust..... minor pitting shouldn't really be a real problem, but flat surfaces are......... if it was mine, I'd do it...... maybe worth a shot, and most you have to lose is gotta buy some new plates.....

 

I did sand the metal plates with some 600 grit to get most of the rust off. Didn't really seem to help much.

I ordered all new plates this morning.

 

Ah, the perils of not being the first-and-only owner of something - the mysteries that pop up from time to time! I hope you get this all sorted out - and it does reinforce my thought about the seller taking it for a warmup before you showed up. I think he knew about this and didn't want you to experience any issues on your test ride. :-(

 

another reason I insist on a stone cold bike (preferably sitting overnight) for a test ride

 

OTOH, this is the first clutch I've seen with rusty plates.... it may have sat a long time without running who knows. We do know oil doesn't get out there, but every bike should be ridden once in a while to prevent these and other things.
Meanwhile, doesn't really matter what bike you buy, you're gonna spend a few bucks on it to catch up on maintenance, brakes, fluids, tires, etc.

 

Meanwhile, doesn't really matter what bike you buy, you're gonna spend a few bucks on it to catch up on maintenance, brakes, fluids, tires, etc.

Yeah, I go into buying a used vehicle with the understanding there will always be things the PO either didn't know, or didn't disclose.

The rest of the bike is in really nice shape and after the clutch that should be it for repairs. I suppose I should check the valve clearances, even thought the PO says he did it at 47900 miles. That's a later project I think.

I did do a 600+ mile trip on it last week and it ran just fine, so I'm not really worried about anything else.

 

Here's a couple of documents I put together about the clutch. One goes into detail on the assembly and the other inspecting the parts. Hope this helps.

 

Thanks, I'll give them a look.

 

New clutch plates are here. How long should I soak them? 30 mins? An hour? More?

 

Well, I soaked them for about 2 hours and then installed them. Interestingly the old friction plates were not the same as the new ones I installed. The new ones are 7 alike, and two different. And the new ones have part numbers stamped into the tabs.

The ones I took out were 8 alike and one different, and no part numbers. Aftermarket maybe?

A quick test in the garage shows major improvement. Started the engine and put it into first while it was cold. Minor clunk and no engine stall. We'll see if that lasts when I can ride it again.

Old parts:

 

Sounds like PO did some poor clutch work - not having the proper parts is never a good thing . Glad everything turned out well in the end (clunk is normal going into first if bike is not moving).

 

Excellent..... actually the pad material doesn't really absorb oil, you're just filling in the surface pores. A few minutes to an hour is more than enough. You'll be amazed how long the oil stays there.
As for you original rusty clutch, I've not seen that on OEM plates, so who knows what was there. Anyway, glad you got it sorted out!! Money well spent.

 

Yes, money well spent. Though the metal plates do look like the OEM plates, but the friction plates do not.

According to the POs notes he replaced the clutch friction discs in Feb 2021 at 42,800 miles, but not the metal ones. No indication of whose friction discs they used. Bike has 54.750 miles on it now.