2003 FJR Clutch Lever Funny Action & Sputtering At Times

642 Views 7 Replies 4 Participants Last post by sunnyorlando, 5 d ago

sunnyorlando

Discussion Starter · 9 d ago

This project that Infnally got on the road is doing some I have not encountered before with the clutch..
First - I'll say that the bike is running real good.
Second - Two issues i noticed on the first ride - clutch and acceleration.

All systems have been flushed with fresh fluid, and fuke is fresh and running fuel system cleaners.

Issue 1 - when pulling the clutch, if you pull quick, it pressurizes and opens the clutch as normal. Every time . However, if you slow pull the lever, it bottoms out without pressurizing to open the clutch. This is not random, it is reproducible every time. > SLOW pull, no pressure. Hard pull, works as expected.
Any thoughts on that?

Issue 2 - there are times where when running at a constant RPM, no matter what gear, it begins to 'sputter' - this is also reproducible. It can be any gear, it's about keeping the throttle constant at any RPM point, or accelerating from a constant.

> At high RPMs, or just running up the RPMs without keeping it constant anywhere along the way, it runs perfect and revs up to the limit in any gear.
> I'm thinking poor fuel deliver to one of the cylinders. I think this because it appears to be fuel related. Maybe a dirt injector.

Thoughts?

Thanks!

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BigOgre

· #2 · 9 d ago

I'll take Issue Two for 400 Alex. What is a TPS.

You've described the symptoms almost spot on. If you go to either side of that narrow RPM range will the sputtering disappear?

Wait . . . Any constant RPM or a specific RPM range in any gear? I might have buzzed in to quickly.

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red

· #3 · 9 d ago (Edited)

sunnyorlando said:
Issue 1 - when pulling the clutch, if you pull quick, it pressurizes and opens the clutch as normal. Every time . However, if you slow pull the lever, it bottoms out without pressurizing to open the clutch. Any thoughts on that?
Issue 2 - there are times where when running at a constant RPM, no matter what gear, it begins to 'sputter' - this is also reproducible. It can be any gear, it's about keeping the throttle constant at any RPM point, or accelerating from a constant. Thoughts? Thanks!

Sunny,

For #1, you prolly need a rebuild of the clutch or slave cylinders, or both. I believe the seal(s) are leaking. Sounds like a quick pull gets the job done, before there is much leakage. Will the pulled clutch re-engage if you hold the lever pulled for a time? If clutch fluid is going lower, the slave cylinder is bad. If you are not losing clutch fluid, the clutch master cylinder is bad.
For #2, I suggest a can of Seafoam (or other quality fuel injector cleaners), mixed per the label instructions. If you actually do need a TBS, you really want to do this step first, anyway.

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RaYzerman

· #4 · 9 d ago

1. Clutch - What mileage and when was the clutch flushed and bled last? I would not normally think these to be a problem, but there are only two hydraulic components, the master and slave cylinders. If not bled within the last two years, time for a flush and bleed. If properly bled, first suggest tying the lever to the handlebar overnight to ensure no air (it should rise to the reservoir, thus purging).
Check brass bushing in clutch lever to ensure not worn oval, if so, replace it and grease with a silicone grease.
If clutch is failing on slow pull, that might indicate the master cylinder needs a rebuild kit..... may be leaking past the rubber parts.

2. Idle issue - Could be a multitude of things..... you will need an OBD adapter harness and an OBD reader. Check for error codes and write them down. On pre-2016, we could access DiAG to look at codes and actuate certain things, but not sure how actuating can be done with a basic OBD reader. You will need a service manual to read all about the various codes, and no guarantee you're not taking the bike to a dealer for further diagnosis.........

Check and make note of throttle percentage opening at idle in real time data. While not completely accurate, this gives you a TPS position value. You COULD attempt an adjustment of the TPS off the typical dead spot at zero throttle, i.e., increase the throttle position value slightly, e.g., if say 18%, move it to 21%. This puts the contacts on a fresher part of the resistance circuit board. IF you chose to replace the TPS, one would put it at the same value you found originally.

Note you have an Accelerator Position Sensor as well. Similar to a TPS but different. Tells the ECU the throttle position. It's not accessible and is under the right side of the throttle bodies. Is it faulty, who knows......

You have two MAP sensors, one with a vacuum hose and I think one open to atmosphere. Check the vacuum nipple and hose are clear of any crud. I don't think an error code is generated unless completely plugged, could be wrong.

There is a DiAG procedure in the sensor actuation menu for all Gen3/4.... DiAG 67, but I'm not sure you actually have to be in that mode. One can reset the Idle Speed Control (ISC) Learning data...... all you can do is try.... ignition on, set the Start/Stop switch from OFF to RUN 3 times within 5 seconds. IF that works, the data is erased and ECU will re-learn.

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sunnyorlando

Discussion Starter · #5 · 9 d ago

Thanks all...
For the clutch, yes, recently flushed/bled. There are no leaks, the fluid level is normal. When I pull it and keep it pulled, the clutch stays open. The issue only happens when it's pulled slowly from a closed position. All you have to do to make it work is pull hard/fast, never fails.
As to the idle issue, it's not in specific RPMs, it about holding it steady for a bit the throttling up for there after that issue starts
Mine is Gen 1 so not sure those codes re there. I can access the Diag Mode, but iinited data. All you g<ave todo this avian now that the bike is fully running.

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RaYzerman

· #6 · 9 d ago

Sorry, I somehow was under the impression it was an '18, got it confused with someone else....
For Gen1, you can attempt to adjust the TPS to a little higher value on the lower end, but at least you can see the values. Although not completely reliable, you can perhaps observe any jumping in values particularly at low throttle angle. A more reliable way would be to backprobe the TPS and observe resistance changes as the throttle is opened (service manual 8-61). Note holding steady throttle is at low throttle openings.
I would verify MAP sensor hose and vac nipple are not clogged.
Spark plugs OK? Spark plug boot resistances OK (if not, disassemble and clean internal spring and resistor), and possible trim 1/8" or so off spark plug wire for fresh contact with the spark plug boots.
How do we feel about injector cleaning (professionally)?

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sunnyorlando

Discussion Starter · #7 · 8 d ago

Thanks....I'll work through that process. Spark plugs are new. Because how it feels, I'm leaning towards maybe an injector or two. I've had good success in the pat projects with running file additives. So, I'm currently running a combination of fuel additives/cleaners to see if it improves over the next 100 mi or so.

I do have an ’18 as my regular ride, but the '03 is a project I picked up.

As to the clutch issue, I've narrowed it down to the master cyl and I have ordered a rebuild kit. I'll also be rebuilding the front brake master cylinder just in case...

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sunnyorlando

Discussion Starter · #8 · 5 d ago

Update - clutch master cyl rebuilt, issue solved.
On to the other issue now...

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