HELLLLP!!! 2009 wont start - Page 4 - Yamaha FJR Forum : Yamaha FJR Owners Forums
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post #31 of 42 (permalink) Old 07-08-2020, 01:32 PM
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No, I meant the long sleeve with the magnets..... if rotated out of position relative to the brushes..... look for that mark on the outside which I hope runs the entire length of the magnet housing and lines up with the same marks on the end caps.
There are 4 permanent magnets, two north pole, two south pole, they have to be in the right place. If 90 degrees off, e.g., the starter will run backwards. If off slightly, the starter loses max power, most efficient when aligned correctly.....
You can Google it.

Let's say the starter runs backwards and you install it.... the starter clutch gears only lock if going forward. If they spin backward they freewheel and do nothing while the starter hums away merrily. Meanwhile you pull the stator cover off to check and everything looks pristine (it is).

If the starter is off-rotation and not getting enough power, it will crank the engine with less power and when you release the starter button, makes a funny noise... no damage, just not what it should be.
When the bike is altogether and you discover this, off comes airbox and throttle bodies again... when you do it three times you kinda get tired of it, LOL... again DAMHIK. Let's just say I learned all this stuff for you.

First, perhaps post a pic of your current alignment.

To test current draw, you'll need a couple of things... I'll see if I can find a write-up.... IF you need it and I hope you don't.

Ray
Keep yer stick on the ice....
2014 FJR1300A - Root Beer (sold)
2009 CBF1000A - Sienna Red
1999 VFR800Fi - Pearl Shining Yellow
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post #32 of 42 (permalink) Old 07-08-2020, 05:36 PM Thread Starter
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Sad news...and my last update.
I got everything (almost) back together...new relay, charged battery and a very clean starter; only thing I left off was the fuel tank. Turned the key to start and **groan**. I thought maybe again the battery was dead so I hooked up a new one. Starter never sounded so weak (as in dead battery sound). I was convinced with the clean commutator and the rest of the crud out, not to mention the starter whirring along fine on the bench, that my problems were solved. It sounds like I didn't even make a difference. In fact, it sounds worse than it did before the relay packed it in. So yes, very much defeated. I'm hesitant to even order a new starter now since I am wondering if it is possible that there is another issue.

Oh well, for now, I am think I am ready to store the FJR - I am just not ready to do that entire process again.
Thanks for all the help.

Randy
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post #33 of 42 (permalink) Old 07-08-2020, 06:08 PM
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I'm gonna bet the magnet housing needs to be rotated.... if you cleaned it so good to take the witness marks off, oops (I did too, don't worry). If it's turning in the right direction (engine turning over), you need a tweak.... hey, you gotta take it all out again anyway now, so......

Shop around for a good used starter off a low miler Gen3... I did that as backup, got harness, relay and all for $90 from a salvage place off a 2015 with 15k on it. New ones are stupid expensive.
I guess I'm looking for the writeup now eh!?

Ray
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2014 FJR1300A - Root Beer (sold)
2009 CBF1000A - Sienna Red
1999 VFR800Fi - Pearl Shining Yellow
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post #34 of 42 (permalink) Old 07-08-2020, 06:44 PM Thread Starter
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Well, okay. I guess I don't have a choice at this point since the bike won't even start in the condition it is in. The idea of taking all that apart again...ughhh.

I don't know where to begin looking - whether for an expert that can rebuild the starter or a new/used one. Unless I pay over $400 from a dealer..there's nothing on amazon, I know of no used bike part dealers (is the Gen III starter the same starter?) and who knows how long anything I order from across the border will take to get here. I know I just don't want to take it apart and put it back together with the same result. I obviously cannot properly repair or test the one I have.

I'll let you know.


Edit: Found an aftermarket one on-line and had it rushed delivery. I'll save this one for my trip to Ontario (when the mercury falls below 40C perhaps) and you can show me how to tweak it over beers

Last edited by Randy_B; 07-08-2020 at 09:25 PM.
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post #35 of 42 (permalink) Old 07-08-2020, 10:57 PM
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Why not take the relay out of the equation ans well as the start button and the ground ..these all hook to the relay ..simply cross a screw driver from the battery terminal to the starter side of the the relay ( dont use a paper clip .. might get burnt ) a LOT of amperage will flow..and at the same time I would hook a volt meter to it ..does the voltage plummet when you cross the poles? it should drop a small amount .. but if it goes a long way...say less then 9.7 volts ..it still may be your battery ( Cant remember if you bought one or not ) ? because if it spins on the bench easily with no load but then wont when a load is applied .... well it may not have the amperage to spin it ..or the wiring to the relay could be faulty
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post #36 of 42 (permalink) Old 07-09-2020, 12:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy_B View Post
Edit: Found an aftermarket one on-line and had it rushed delivery.

I'm curious... where did you find a starter? Reason I ask is that I was wondering if it was from these guys whom I just recently became aware of:
https://www.dbelectrical.com/
They have an FJR starter for $70 and it's described as "100% Brand New Aftermarket Part"...whatever that means.
Anyway, the OEM unit from www. partzilla is around $300 I believe...
Regards,
Mr. BR


Edit: btw, that slider thing you tagged on one of your pictures is the cold start/high idle mechanism... the slider opens a plunger on each Throttle body and these close up as engine warms (from those two small coolants lines).

Last edited by Mr. BR; 07-09-2020 at 12:39 AM.
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post #37 of 42 (permalink) Old 07-16-2020, 07:11 PM Thread Starter
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Hey everyone. Thought I would close off this thread with one final entry. I think it's at the very least a courtesy to others who have given me their time but also useful for others down the road if they come across the same problem.

In a nutshell, I got a new starter in and the bike runs like a top. Even the manifold was perfectly in sync.



Mr. BR: I did find that site as well but they don't ship to Canukistan. They have an identical Canadian website under a completely different name but much like Amazon Canada - virtually nothing available.I ended up finding several retailers on e-bay but most were China based. One did however ship from the States and it too was only $70 USD. I ended up spending equally as much on shipping and customs but still worked out to half the $$$ and time it would have been to buy from a Yamaha dealer in Canada. The starter looks identical to OEM but has somewhat of an ST1300 sound -haha.


Thanks to all, but a special thanks to RyZerman for holding my hand. You were right and I surprised even myself in tearing down the bike the 2nd time around in less than an hour, installing the starter and reassembly took about another 3. You don't really need to pull the injector electrical plugs or even the throttle cables to access the starter either. But it was nice to have done the the first time since the bike seems to run smoother (in the garage) with all that gunk cleaned out of the intakes and valves.



For the reference of others, a couple of PITA points were the coolant line that runs through the injector rail. Unless you drain the coolant before-hand, it's going to leak into the depression that holds the starter. At least have a stubby screwdriver handy to plug the tube. You also need a universal joint on a socket for one of the 5mm (or 6mm?) bolts that the holds the starter. Perhaps a really long allen wrench would suffice but I couldnt access the bolt except on an angle (which would strip the head) until I used the u-joint adapter.

I also found the little orange thing-a-ma-jig that protects the connector that holds the fuel line to the injector rail to be a beyotch to remove. You have to play with it to know what I mean I guess. Oh yeah, make sure once you've loosened the bolts that hold the boots from the filter box to the manifold that you lift the entire manifold assembly up from the rubber boots side and not from the air box side and then slide the entire unit out.



Well that's it that's all. Now that the bike is back together I'm off to start a new fix-it project. While waiting for the starter to arrive, I de-winterized my boat with a 5.0L Mercruiser. Guess I didn't fog it well enough last season since I have - at best, a stuck intake valve and at worse, a bent rod. I found this out within 15 seconds of starting it when, what I thought was a backfire, was the sound of whatever it was breaking. Lifting the heads on this V-8 makes working the FJR seem like kiddy-pool stuff.



Ray - Ive saved the starter. I'm bringing it your way whenever I finally resume my trip!


R
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post #38 of 42 (permalink) Old 07-16-2020, 11:08 PM
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Ok kool, glad you got it fixed.... about that orange thing, just pull it out, it's a cover on a slide, no need to remove, then you can see the two gray push buttons.... now tell me you undid it at the fuel rail and not at the tank end, lol. PS, I should really invent a special pair of pliers to push them gray things, I have fat fingers.

Ray
Keep yer stick on the ice....
2014 FJR1300A - Root Beer (sold)
2009 CBF1000A - Sienna Red
1999 VFR800Fi - Pearl Shining Yellow
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post #39 of 42 (permalink) Old 07-17-2020, 12:14 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by RaYzerman View Post
Ok kool, glad you got it fixed.... about that orange thing, just pull it out, it's a cover on a slide, no need to remove, then you can see the two gray push buttons.... now tell me you undid it at the fuel rail and not at the tank end, lol. PS, I should really invent a special pair of pliers to push them gray things, I have fat fingers.

Yes, I disconnected at the fuel rail.

I have one quick question left: Found this under the bike after all was said and done. Did it come from the bike? Can't think of possibly where. (Chapstick for reference)
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1CIS...ew?usp=sharing
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post #40 of 42 (permalink) Old 07-17-2020, 07:31 AM
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Randy, you made my day, glad to hear itís fixed. Been following your thread from the start so thankyou for the follow-up. Hope you get many smiles out of your bike !

Steve P
Red 2014A, the fastest color !
Ride more,, worry less !
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