ABS Questions - Yamaha FJR Forum : Yamaha FJR Owners Forums
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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 05-27-2020, 04:02 AM Thread Starter
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Question ABS Questions

Hello,

Last year, I bought a 06 FJR1300A with 51K KM's to make my 16 year old dreams come to true with a tight budget. I never used bike with an abs so no experience with them. On initial checking, I put on middle kickstand and test the gears. When speed is passing 20KM's, ABS light is starting to pulse so I think ABS is ok. 2 weeks ago, a car suddenly change a lane and perform a hard brake front of me for turning to another road. Reflexively I pulled front brake, slip sound comes from front wheel and death wobble started Recovered wobble after releasing front brake. After all that stopped a while for smoking and calm down, I realized no abs pulse or light comes on so I done a short test last night. In second gear and around 50KM/h, pushed rear brake very hard, rear wheel locked and engine stops with no abs light or pulse on lever. After releasing brake lever, with a momentum of bike, engine re-runs. From all that, it looks ABS not working. In this case what diagnostics can be performed or what can be checked before going to mechanic? I am %100 sure mechanic will tell "we need to replace master cylinder" even its ok
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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 05-27-2020, 07:16 AM
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Welcome. You are listing symptoms that have nothing to do with abs. Nothing you do on the centerstand, as far as running the bike, will test abs. It simply doesn’t work that way.

Running it on the centerstand will, rightly, cause the system to detect a failure (front wheel speed doesn’t match), and may cause it to disable abs and/or generate a fault code.

As far as the engine stopping and restarting during your re-test, engine operation and braking aren’t related- unless you forget to use your clutch...

In summary, stop trying to test things by running the bike on the centerstand. To test abs, either induce lockup in montion, in a controlled setting, or buy an abs test harness from Fjriders.com, when they’re back in stock.

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Last edited by Bill Lumberg; 05-27-2020 at 07:36 AM.
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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 05-27-2020, 07:39 AM
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Odd the front doesn't at least work.... meaning the whole thing doesn't work and all you have is standard braking... so, the electrial basics must be sound.
The ABS fuse is the 30 amp fuse on the side of the starter relay, and that sends main power to the ABS relay (likely found under the right side cover near the ABS pump). The trigger circuit comes from the ABS ECU (when conditions dicatate), or via the ABS diagnostic connector up by the battery.
Check the fuse. Then either use an ABS test harness to activate the test sequence or short the sky blue and black terminals in the diagnostic connector. If the pump does not run, then you need to test the relay, which shouldn't be bad because it doesn't get much use.
Next thing to do is remove the wheel sensors, clean any white (aluminum) corrosion off them and the hole they mount in, and coat them lightly with silicone grease, reinstall. This will assure the ABS ECU is seeing clean sensor signals.
I believe the ABS light should come on when you first start the bike, and it will go off when you get moving (ABS ECU sees normal wheel signals). If it is flashing, it means ABS is not working, or abnormal wheel signals, or perhaps some error codes exist..
Next thing to do is go into the diagnostic screen and see what error codes exist... best have a service manual.....
Replacing a master cylinder will not cure your issue. Hopefully you can do the simple fixes first and avoid having to replace the ABS Pump assembly ($$$$).
The next step is, does the ABS pump run the diagnostic test........... keep us posted.

Ray
Keep yer stick on the ice....
2014 FJR1300A - Root Beer (sold)
2009 CBF1000A - Sienna Red
1999 VFR800Fi - Pearl Shining Yellow
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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 05-27-2020, 09:16 AM
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Reflexively I pulled front brake, slip sound comes from front wheel and death wobble started Recovered wobble after releasing front brake.

?????????????????
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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 05-27-2020, 09:26 AM
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My money says he got it to fault on the stand, before he tried it riding it. I think it‘ll work iif unmolested and ridden.

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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 05-27-2020, 05:24 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philharmonic View Post
Reflexively I pulled front brake, slip sound comes from front wheel and death wobble started Recovered wobble after releasing front brake.

?????????????????
Forgive my english as not native to it. I tried to say, imagine someone will cut off and brake check front of you and you realized you can not stop at that speed and pull brakes as hard as you can. You have very little time to think so in this case I think rear brake cant save me and used my most force on front brake.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Lumberg View Post
Welcome. You are listing symptoms that have nothing to do with abs. Nothing you do on the centerstand, as far as running the bike, will test abs. It simply doesn’t work that way.

Running it on the centerstand will, rightly, cause the system to detect a failure (front wheel speed doesn’t match), and may cause it to disable abs and/or generate a fault code.

As far as the engine stopping and restarting during your re-test, engine operation and braking aren’t related- unless you forget to use your clutch...

In summary, stop trying to test things by running the bike on the centerstand. To test abs, either induce lockup in montion, in a controlled setting, or buy an abs test harness from Fjriders.com, when they’re back in stock.
Thanks, as mentioned I have zero experience with abs so main purpose of this testing gears shifting properly because previous owner does not allow to ride before buying. After I saw abs light, assumed that its ok and does not needed for extra testing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RaYzerman View Post
Odd the front doesn't at least work.... meaning the whole thing doesn't work and all you have is standard braking... so, the electrial basics must be sound.
The ABS fuse is the 30 amp fuse on the side of the starter relay, and that sends main power to the ABS relay (likely found under the right side cover near the ABS pump). The trigger circuit comes from the ABS ECU (when conditions dicatate), or via the ABS diagnostic connector up by the battery.
Check the fuse. Then either use an ABS test harness to activate the test sequence or short the sky blue and black terminals in the diagnostic connector. If the pump does not run, then you need to test the relay, which shouldn't be bad because it doesn't get much use.
Next thing to do is remove the wheel sensors, clean any white (aluminum) corrosion off them and the hole they mount in, and coat them lightly with silicone grease, reinstall. This will assure the ABS ECU is seeing clean sensor signals.
I believe the ABS light should come on when you first start the bike, and it will go off when you get moving (ABS ECU sees normal wheel signals). If it is flashing, it means ABS is not working, or abnormal wheel signals, or perhaps some error codes exist..
Next thing to do is go into the diagnostic screen and see what error codes exist... best have a service manual.....
Replacing a master cylinder will not cure your issue. Hopefully you can do the simple fixes first and avoid having to replace the ABS Pump assembly ($$$$).
The next step is, does the ABS pump run the diagnostic test........... keep us posted.
Thanks for your reply. In Turkey fraudment rate too high. Even in authorized dealers and services. If they recognized that you dont understand basics/mechanics you have a big hole in your wallet. Anyway...
Have a limited time today so I went down to garage and do a quick test:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ifritm6ppg...15024.mp4?dl=0

Shorted pins, armed for 5 seconds with crank button, held both front and rear brake. Good thing that pump works but I am not sure about it sounds good or not, not like the sound on videos I watched at least. There are 3 codes that cycles ABS-11, ABS-24 and ABS-25 which I cant find clear information about. On a video I watched before, you need to turn on ignition switch then push crank for clearing codes but it actually cranked the engine so I miss a step probably or totally normal situation.

As you said ABS light lit during engine crank and went off after engine runs. Tomorrow I have more time for diagnosis so continue tomorrow.
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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 05-27-2020, 05:56 PM
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First thing, get a service manual. Download it here -> https://www.dropbox.com/s/rsh6lcu3yv...rvice.pdf?dl=0

This is a summary of how to cycle the ABS. I use method #2 - >https://www.dropbox.com/s/30u7d9l6ao...0%20A.pdf?dl=0

The pictures below show the connector, just forward of the battery. On your bike it may not be "the sky blue" wire Ray describes. Like mine, it may be a light blue with brown dots, circled in red. I use an alligator clip to jump it to the black wire as shown. Note the orientation of the plug per the pictures attached.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_20200524_115942879.jpg (90.4 KB, 7 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20200524_115951461.jpg (82.6 KB, 5 views)
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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 05-27-2020, 08:36 PM
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You are doing great. We are just gathering info as we follow along. You are giving very good information. We look forward to hearing how things ego.
Quote:
Originally Posted by helvaciy View Post
Forgive my english as not native to it. I tried to say, imagine someone will cut off and brake check front of you and you realized you can not stop at that speed and pull brakes as hard as you can. You have very little time to think so in this case I think rear brake cant save me and used my most force on front brake.




Thanks, as mentioned I have zero experience with abs so main purpose of this testing gears shifting properly because previous owner does not allow to ride before buying. After I saw abs light, assumed that its ok and does not needed for extra testing.



Thanks for your reply. In Turkey fraudment rate too high. Even in authorized dealers and services. If they recognized that you dont understand basics/mechanics you have a big hole in your wallet. Anyway...
Have a limited time today so I went down to garage and do a quick test:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ifritm6ppg...15024.mp4?dl=0

Shorted pins, armed for 5 seconds with crank button, held both front and rear brake. Good thing that pump works but I am not sure about it sounds good or not, not like the sound on videos I watched at least. There are 3 codes that cycles ABS-11, ABS-24 and ABS-25 which I cant find clear information about. On a video I watched before, you need to turn on ignition switch then push crank for clearing codes but it actually cranked the engine so I miss a step probably or totally normal situation.

As you said ABS light lit during engine crank and went off after engine runs. Tomorrow I have more time for diagnosis so continue tomorrow.
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2018 FJR1300ES Stealth Model

IBA# 69560
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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 05-27-2020, 11:10 PM
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When you ran the test, did the front brake lever and rear pedal pulsate, front first then rear? If so, ABS pump is at least working on both wheels and hopefully there is no blockage.


I wasn't clear on your emergency braking situation, when you were using maximum braking did you feel pulsations in the front lever, and did you feel a similar pulsing in the rear pedal?


ABS11 and ABS 25 are front wheel sensor signals not being received... I suspect that would be if you ran the bike on the centerstand and the rear wheel turned but the front didn't (for 20 seconds or more).
ABS24 is related to the rear brake light not being operative... check fuses, connections, the relay itself, brake light switch at the front lever and the rear pedal.
You can clear all these codes and see if they return under normal riding, that is, both wheels turning. Brake light issues you'll have to investigate.. if the rear brake light works now, may have been temporary, but if not working I am not sure if that would prevent the rear ABS from working... it may or may not.
Be aware also in a panic situation, if the weight is all thrown to the front, the rear wheel may not have had enough weight in a situation where it is barely on the ground, that is, ABS is not perfect in those situations.


To clear the codes while in ABS mode, install the ABS harness or jumper to short sky blue and black, put the kill switch (emergency stop switch) to RUN, turn on ignition, then put the kill switch to Stop, now press the Start button 10 times within 4 seconds and codes should be erased.

Ray
Keep yer stick on the ice....
2014 FJR1300A - Root Beer (sold)
2009 CBF1000A - Sienna Red
1999 VFR800Fi - Pearl Shining Yellow
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