Which steering stem wrench is this? - Page 4 - Yamaha FJR Forum : Yamaha FJR Owners Forums
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post #31 of 51 (permalink) Old 03-01-2018, 04:43 PM Thread Starter
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I don't suppose this argument has anything to do with the widely inconsistent wobble issue?

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post #32 of 51 (permalink) Old 03-13-2018, 01:03 PM Thread Starter
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I did the procedure yesterday and I got my torque wrench to click at 37ft/lbs I'm a little concerned about how hard I had to pull on the wrench. I suppose the strange leverage of doing this is the reason?

Anyway, as delivered when I'd wiggle the bars at speed the bike would wobble back and fourth several times. Now it only does it once or twice, does that mean they were loose?

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post #33 of 51 (permalink) Old 03-13-2018, 07:25 PM
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I did the procedure yesterday and I got my torque wrench to click at 37ft/lbs I'm a little concerned about how hard I had to pull on the wrench. I suppose the strange leverage of doing this is the reason?
If you pull the torque wrench two-handed (the way you are supposed to use all ratchets) then the torque is same with spanner as socket. If one-handed then you add a side load to the nut.

You did read the spec and know you tighten to 37, loosen to zero, and then back to 13?

In my experience with GL1800 and FJR once the wobble starts no re-torquing can remedy. But heck, one can’t be faulted for trying. I tried. More than twice.

All-Balls tapered bearing retrofit kit was only $30 but with my Helibar rise-and-rear I took 6 hours to install. Also bought Motion Pro steering stem driver for about $40. Had a nice long 1/2” bar to use as drift to drive the old seats out. And Dremel Mototool to slice the bottom race. Later the sliced bottom race was handy for driving the new tapered bottom race on steering stem.

The Helibar riser necessitates removal to access center steering stem top nut. Without this I believe the top bridge can come off with handlebars attached.

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post #34 of 51 (permalink) Old 03-13-2018, 07:34 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by N4HHE View Post
If you pull the torque wrench two-handed (the way you are supposed to use all ratchets) then the torque is same with spanner as socket. If one-handed then you add a side load to the nut.

You did read the spec and know you tighten to 37, loosen to zero, and then back to 13?

In my experience with GL1800 and FJR once the wobble starts no re-torquing can remedy. But heck, one can’t be faulted for trying. I tried. More than twice.

All-Balls tapered bearing retrofit kit was only $30 but with my Helibar rise-and-rear I took 6 hours to install. Also bought Motion Pro steering stem driver for about $40. Had a nice long 1/2” bar to use as drift to drive the old seats out. And Dremel Mototool to slice the bottom race. Later the sliced bottom race was handy for driving the new tapered bottom race on steering stem.




The Helibar riser necessitates removal to access center steering stem top nut. Without this I believe the top bridge can come off with handlebars attached.
I did it just like this but he doesn't really use two hands. Does side loading increase or decrease torque?

https://youtu.be/eBXaLOz2nM0?t=997

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Last edited by Ditch; 03-13-2018 at 07:59 PM.
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post #35 of 51 (permalink) Old 03-14-2018, 12:59 AM
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I did it just like this but he doesn't really use two hands. Does side loading increase or decrease torque?

https://youtu.be/eBXaLOz2nM0?t=997
I don’t watch Bryan’s videos. Takes 15 minutes to cover 15 seconds of reading. Seems to me he reads his material for the first time an hour before making the video and then reads it back to you as if he is a genius. Which seems to be his primary source of income. At least until he got laughed off or thrown off Facebook.

A ratchet (or torque wrench) should never be used one-handed due to the side load placed on socket at bolt head which tries to flip the socket off. This is also how one breaks spark plugs with side load on the porcelain. How sockets “slip” off and knuckles bruised. If you use an extension you quickly learn you can’t allow a side load on the nut/socket.

Anyway, palm on the head of torque wrench and other hand on handle, apply same force with both hands and there will be no side load on the socket or the steering stem spanner.

If you absolutely must torque one-handed then affix the spanner at 90° from the torque wrench beam so your side forces go straight through center of nut.
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post #36 of 51 (permalink) Old 03-19-2018, 05:01 PM Thread Starter
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I bit the bullet and bought a socket, my sincere apologies to @Bernie , that spanner is indeed piece of garbage. I got this one instead of the most expensive one, looks hand made by the seller. I'll let you guys know tomorrow how it works out.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Steering-St...JT-rH8&vxp=mtr

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post #37 of 51 (permalink) Old 03-19-2018, 06:41 PM
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Not sure if you have come to an agreement on this subject, but the thing is that you is not changing the moment by changing the key length. I attached an illustration showing this.
BUT, if the angle between the key and the wrench is not 90 deg., the error will increase with a longer key, so the shorter the key is, the more accurate you will (in real life) be able to set the moment. The shortest key is called a socket

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post #38 of 51 (permalink) Old 03-19-2018, 06:48 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by rogerf View Post
Not sure if you have come to an agreement on this subject, but the thing is that you is not changing the moment by changing the key length. I attached an illustration showing this.
BUT, if the angle between the key and the wrench is not 90 deg., the error will increase with a longer key, so the shorter the key is, the more accurate you will (in real life) be able to set the moment. The shortest key is called a socket

<rogerf/>
I think we've agreed the spanner doesn't change the lever. So just to confirm, it's correct to torque the socket to 37ft/lbs because it cancels out the 90 degree effect created by the spanner?

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Last edited by Ditch; 03-19-2018 at 06:54 PM.
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post #39 of 51 (permalink) Old 03-19-2018, 07:01 PM
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Hi, with a socket, it will still be the same. Arm is still measured from your arm (force) and to the pivot point (stem nut). I do not like to start my post by "I am an engineer and this is my work" on a non work forum, but at this particular discussion it really matters and would be kind of stupid to not say. This is basic math/engineering. New sketch :-)


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post #40 of 51 (permalink) Old 03-19-2018, 10:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rogerf View Post
Not sure if you have come to an agreement on this subject, but the thing is that you is not changing the moment by changing the key length. I attached an illustration showing this.
BUT, if the angle between the key and the wrench is not 90 deg., the error will increase with a longer key, so the shorter the key is, the more accurate you will (in real life) be able to set the moment. The shortest key is called a socket

<rogerf/>
Your illustration demonstrates my claim. One is not supposed to pull on any socket one-handed no matter the ratchet or torque wrench has only one handle.

A moment (torque) is a couple, a pair of countering forces a distance apart. The angle with the spanner makes no difference unless you are improperly pulling one handed which results in a counter lateral force at the nut.

Consider a socket on a 12” extension and a 12” ratchet. You instantly learn not to pull one handed on the ratchet else twist the socket off the nut sideways. Whether an extension is used or not the same 2-handed technique is always required so as to not strip nuts due to socket slipping off due to lateral force creating another twisting moment between nut and head of wrench.

With proper technique there is never a lateral force on the nut, only a pure torque.

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